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There was an interesting debate on crowd-sourcing this week, held by the Institute for Government.

Their video of the event is below, and I've also pulled out a few of the tweets from the event that raised some of the most interesting issues.

For me the most remarkable thing about it was how mainstream the idea has become since the last election (hard to get much more establishment than the IfG).

For all the flaws, which are often more in the implementation than the concept, the idea of crowd-sourcing is now firmly established as a tool in the digital engagement armoury.

Some tweets

Govt could have more transparent deliberation of pros and cons of policy, not just taking 'input' and locking selves away. #ifgcrowds
@cath_haddon
Catherine Haddon

This is a really important point about the 'black box' of the policy making process. It also applies more widely to issues such as freedom of information and open data. I've previously discussed the benefits of more openness in policy-making in a post on the slightly unusual subject of the Iraq war and eDemocracy.

Still not sure about the added value of crowdsourcing beyond it being a innovative form of surveying #ifgcrowds
@Kateblatchford
Kate Blatchford

An interesting point which is also related to this tweet:

.@ poses interesting Q: should gvt be playing guessing game with public or consulting experts in particular fields? #ifgcrowds
@amyjsmith
Amy Smith

Those two tweets raise a couple of issues.

The first is, do you really trust your crowd-sourcing exercise? This relates to a range of issues involving participation, self-selection, representativeness, etc.

The second question that follows on from that is even if you trust the validity of the inputs, does that make the outputs right?

The answers to those questions go into a deeper set of issues around deliberative mechanisms and user-led service design.

Are civil servants supposed to 'represent' the public, as @ says at #ifgcrowds ? Or is that the job of politicians?
@owenbarder
Owen Barder

Last time I considered this point, I came to the conclusion that social media might well invert traditional roles and require civil servants to do more to represent the public than at present.

And for some more on the event, Simon Burall of Involve (one of the participants) has posted his thoughts on the issue.

The video

And here is the video, which is worth watching.

The Commons procedure committee has published its interim report on ePetitions.

The two main conclusions of the inquiry were largely as predicted in this blog's previous post on the committee's inquiry.

Most importantly, the procedure committee says debates should take place in a dedicated time slot on a Monday afternoon in Westminster Hall, rather than in the Commons chamber.

"We recommend that the Standing Orders should be changed to allow the Backbench Business Committee to schedule debates on Government e-petitions between 4.30 and 7.30 pm on a Monday in Westminster Hall. The sitting would only take place if the Backbench Business Committee had set down the subjects of e-petitions for debate. The debate would take place on the motion 'That this House has considered the e-petition from [petitioners] relating to [subject of petition]'. We recommend that this change should be introduced on an experimental basis for one year and that its effectiveness should be reviewed at the end of that period. "

It has been argued that moving the debate out of the Commons chamber would suggest to the petitioners that their concerns are given a lower priority, though the committee rejects that and notes that frontbench spokesmen would be required to set out their positions during the debate.

Arguably more significant is the change to the format of the motion being debated.

Whereas last October's Commons debate on the Hillsborough disaster was on a motion which "calls for the full disclosure of all Government-related documents", presumably the new equivalent would have been that the Commons "has considered the e-petition relating to the disclosure of Hillsborough documents" – a much weaker formulation, with a vote not on supporting or opposing the actual disclosure but on agreeing just that the issue had been discussed.

Unless I have misunderstood the proposal, that seems like a backwards step.

The somewhat less significant recommendations call for clearer text on the ePetitions website and improved communication with the sponsors of the petitions. The committee says:

"We recommend that the Government should remove the sentence 'e-petitions is an easy way for you to influence government policy in the UK' from its e-petitions

website and replace it with a statement that more accurately reflects reality. We

propose: 'e-petitions are an easy way for you to make sure your concerns are heard

by Government and Parliament'.

The aim is to essentially downplay what might be achieved by an ePetition. And the MPs also call for more information for the petitioners to help them understand the process better, particularly when it comes to ensuring they know to contact an MP to take their petition forward.

For example, the ePetition on pensions uprating has reached the 100,000 threshold but so far no MPs have told the backbench business committee that they are prepared to lead a debate on it.

The committee says its report is focused on dealing with some of the more obvious flaws in the ePetitions system and does not address deeper issues of public engagement with parliamentary processes.

"We have not, in this short inquiry, sought to address wider questions about public engagement with Parliament, reform of the House's own procedures for petitions, the treatment of e-petitions other than those submitted on the Government's website, and the role of the Backbench Business Committee. We believe that all of these subjects are worthy of more considered examination by us in the future."

So another review of these issues seems likely, and could further improve public engagement with Parliament at some point in the future. It might be after this that the whole ePetitions system is transferred from the government to Parliament.

The committee also said that there should have been more consultation with Parliament before ministers took the plans forward.

"We agree with the Chair of the Backbench Business Committee, Natascha Engel, that 'a lot of the problems that have arisen were perfectly foreseeable and had there been a debate, and perhaps even a vote, they would have been highlighted.'

"We regret that the Government did not see fit to refer its proposals for its e-petitions system to us or to place its plans formally before the House for debate and decision before the scheme was introduced."

I think the MPs are right that plenty of the problems thrown up were totally foreseeable.

That said, however, the government's use of ePetitions as a test of its move towards more agility in IT was always likely to involve something of a culture clash when pitched against the less-than-agile decision-making processes in Parliament.

If it had been left to Parliament, it seems more than possible that assorted committees and officials would still be pondering the £1.3m price tag previously estimated for the first year of such a project, while the government got it built and running for around £132,000.

It isn't ideal, but this is an issue where the 'just do it' approach was probably the right one. If the committee and the House wanted more control over the system then they could and should have built it themselves (although the procedure committee would probably argue that no time was ever given to vote on its previous proposals, which is a separate set of problems).

Without the government getting on with it, however, the significant level of public interest and engagement which has been generated (and which the committee welcomed) would never have materialised.

Disruptive technology wins out, and can now be iterated and improved having been introduced. Not a smooth process in this case given the inter-institutional tensions, but on balance probably as good as it was going to get. Better some innovation than none.

Padlocked data Ministers have been warned their plans for a Public Data Corporation (PDC) "negatively affected the global credibility" of their open data commitments.

The latest minutes of the Cabinet Office's transparency board suggest business minister Ed Davey faced some scepticism when he discussed the PDC plans at the October meeting.

The Board told the minister "they were likely to be challenging in order to get a solution which achieved their aims", say the minutes.

"Clearly their main focus would be on how the proposals could best support Open Data and Transparency objectives, but they were also concerned on behalf of all users of the PDC's data."

During the discussions the Board also indicated that the PDC proposal has damaged the government's reputation on open data.

"It was important that the Government was able to make a clearer statement soon, in particular to reassure some parts of the Open Data community that the Public Data Corporation would be a step forward for Open Data, not a step backwards.

"Members considered that the consultation paper had already negatively affected the global credibility of the UK Government's commitment to Open Data.

"It was essential not only that governance of the PDC had opening up data at its core but also that it was driven by the needs of all data users."

Other points made at the meeting were that the value of the data was in its use rather than its sale and there should be "a clear road map" for releasing more data after the creation of the PDC.

There was also concern that "if there was greater involvement of the private sector (in line with one of the PDC objectives), the public interest in and ownership of core reference data was safeguarded"

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